DCMarvelModern Myth Media Modern Myth Media Podcast #256: State Of The Superhero Genre Address written by Sean Gerber July 12, 2016 The Modern Myth Media podcast is back! We resume just we began over five years ago, with our State of the Superhero Genre Address. Host Sean Gerber is joined by Katie Sullivan, Chris Clow, and Robert Reineke to discuss the current superhero movie climate. Has the genre reached its point of saturation? What are the challenges that face the three shared universes (Marvel, DC, Fox Marvel) in a landscape that’s more competitive than ever before? These questions and more are discussed in our 256th episode! Programming note: The Modern Myth Media podcast has a new RSS feed. If you have previously subscribed to the show, but are not seeing episode #256, then your subscription is pulling from the old RSS feed. An easy workaround for this is to unsubscribe from the MMM podcast, then run a search for it through your preferred podcast provider and subscribe again. If you are still having any difficulty finding the new episode, please advise us in the comments section below and be sure to list the podcast provider. For new links with the updated RSS feed, see immediately below. iTunes SoundCloud Google Play (coming soon) RSS Modern Myth Media Podcast #256: State Of The Superhero Genre Address was last modified: July 12th, 2016 by Sean Gerber Related Ant-Man and the WaspAquamanAvengers: Infinity WarBatman v Superman: Dawn of JusticeBlack PantherCaptain America: Civil WarCaptain MarvelCyborgDeadpoolDoctor StrangeGuardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2Justice LeagueSpider-Man: HomecomingSuicide SquadThe FlashThor: RagnarokWonder WomanX-Men: Apocalypse 7 comments 0 Facebook Twitter Google + Pinterest Sean Gerber Sean Gerber is the founder and editor-in-chief of Modern Myth Media. When he's not writing here, you can catch him as the host of Popular Opinion Podcast, Batman News, and Marvel News! previous post Marvel’s DOCTOR STRANGE Villain Confirmed, But Still Unknown next post MMM Podcast #257: Sequelitis You may also like MMM Podcast #180: GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY... May 21, 2014 Disney Infinity: Marvel Super Heroes Says ‘Hello’... July 28, 2014 Vote for the 2016 Modern Myth Movie... January 9, 2017 MMM #206: BATMAN V SUPERMAN Moves; DC... August 7, 2014 MMM #235: Hardy Out, Batman In SUICIDE... January 26, 2015 MMM Podcast #182: Gareth Edwards Directing The... May 23, 2014 MMM Podcast #183: X-MEN: DAYS OF FUTURE... May 26, 2014 MMM & BOF Podcast, Episode 66: Batman... April 25, 2012 MMM #241: Spider-Man In The MCU, BATMAN... February 17, 2015 Moving Forward, No News Is Good News... March 3, 2017 Nathan Ivey I did not see ep#256 until I did a search in iTunes. I was already subscribed to the show, but did not know about the new episode until your message podcast today. I tried unsubscribing and re-subscribing, but even with my setting set to down load new episode, it was not automatically downloading. You said to post here with our podcast provider if there is an issue. Well, iTunes is not automatically downloading new episodes for me. Thanks. bookee I think what deborah snyder really wanted to say was people dont want to see their favorite characters messed with. They are die hard fans who want to their heroes to be everything they remember from their favorite representation of that character. And if they dont get that they look at the movie in a worse way. I do think BvS had some issues like other movies but i think its flaws are over exaggerated due to lack of faithfulness to the source material. Joshua Nathan Strong Man I hate it, hate it, hate it when people say that “Zack Snyder didn’t read/hates/is not familiar with the source material”. Just because you have problems with his interpretation or films, that doesn’t mean that Snyder hates or isn’t familiar with the source material. That’s like saying, “Paul Feig made an all female Ghostbuster movie, so he totally hates the 1984 movie”. Just say that you don’t like where he’s coming from or that you don’t agree with his intrepetation. Sean Gerber My comment was not based solely on a difference of interpretation. Snyder has actually said in interviews how superhero comics did not appeal to him until he saw books that included more violence and sex. Joshua Nathan Strong I’m familiar with that interview from EW from when Watchmen came out. If more mature fare got him into comic books that’s cool, to each their own. Everyone has that one thing that got them into comics or the other stuff that they love and are passionate about. Matthew Dickinson It’s ironic that you talk about how superhero films, especially Marvel movies, need to diversify to keep being popular (which I agree) and then switch to talking about BvS, which partly was disliked because it ‘wasn’t Marvel enough’. That’s not a criticism of the podcast, it’s just strange how things sound when you look at them slightly out of context. Deborah Snyder’s comment that ‘people don’t like to see their heroes deconstructed’ also annoyed me. I think Bale’s Batman was in fact deconstructed in The Dark Knight Rises, it wasn’t so meta in refering to the concept of superheroes in general in the way Watchmen did or BvS tried to, but it deals again with the consequences of Batman like The Dark Knight film as well as the lie from the end of the second film. Even more it reverses the construction of Batman Begins by taking apart this version of Batman in a way personal to him; the Bane fight shows none of his tricks at intimidation work and as a friend watching it with me for the first time on DVD said ‘it doesn’t feel like he’s Batman any more, it’s like he’s just a guy in a cape’; in the pit he unlearns his mastery over fear, which he had to do to become Batman in Begins, and his final act as Batman was breaking his one rule by killing Talia. It’s interesting when you say Marvel is very good at learning the right lessons from its successes and failures. I think that’s a great observation and I think that the difference with Warner is that they learn all the wrong lessons! Like you say they are obsessed with Batman and especially the Nolan version of him and, much like 90’s comics after Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen, they think violence and ‘darkness’ are what made those work rather than intelligence, characterisation, uniqueness and good execution. I was a little worried about Suicide Squad for a while because I thought it’s yet another heavily Batman DC film, but like you guys say it should be. Now I’m hoping they will create a sort of Batman/Gotham cinematic universe and keep that fairly separate from the other heroes like Superman and Flash for the reasons stated in the podcast. Failing that I’d rather they just had a Gotham universe and left the other members of the Justice League for the time being rather than have them treated like Superman was in BvS. Oumar I enjoyed the podcast extremely. It was great to hear Chris, Robert & Katie again. Not that I didn’t enjoy you Sean, but i pretty much follow all of your pods, so I hear from you almost every other week. My main point of contention was with a lot that was said about Batman V Superman, but mainly the characterization of Batman. Your point is spot on, that in The Dark Knight trilogy, Batman is the most optimistic of all. I do believe that BVS time and time again, told us that the Batman we were seeing, is not who he was up to this point. Alfred clearly states this in that “new rules” scene. He’s angry, has lost a Robin, Wayne manor has burned to the ground and he hasn’t even attempted to rebuild it. His mind is clearly being corrupted by visions and knightmares! We find this Batman at a very, very dark place. He feels as though he has wasted away his life and has done no good in the world. If anything, this Batman is heartbroken. After the brilliance of the Nolan trilogy, I think this was probably the most interesting step to take with this character. We weren’t going to get another origin story. At the end of the film, thanks to Superman, Bruce is that optimist once again who believes in humanity and is prepared to fight for them once more. It was an interesting arc for a character that we have seen many times on the silver screen. Aside from that, I pretty much agree with all that you said about Marvel. I really like the new directors they’ve hired, I just really hope that Marvel allows them to express themselves fully. Or else it will all have been for nothing. I enjoyed your final thoughts and agreed with all of them. Social media has brought out the worst in many people. Hopefully we will be able to once again find some semblance of civility. I did love BVS, but being a fan of it has not always been a fun experience. It’s never a good time listening or reading someone bash something that you enjoy. All in all, I’m very happy the podcast is back, and I hope that we continue to get great comic book films and the genre continues to grow.